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Chummy door cards
#21
I had some samples of modern Rexine when I had my RK reupholstered. Unfortunately the upholsterers thought them not as strong as the original and likely to tear along stitch lines. However I would think it would work for door cards etc but not for seats.
Jim
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#22
(09-10-2018, 03:03 PM)AustinWood Wrote: I had some samples of modern Rexine when I had my RK reupholstered. Unfortunately the upholsterers thought them not as strong as the original and likely to tear along stitch lines. However I would think it would work for door cards etc but not for seats.

Agree, OK for anything which has a solid backing. It's prone to creasing.
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#23
To add my bit to Russell's very detailed list: if staples are hidden, which they should be, then stainless steel ones will probably outlast the upholstery.

Standard ones, particularly the Far Eastern ones on the market thse days, are often rusty before the item leaves the factory, so not very good if the car interior is liable to be damp at any time.

Stainless not so easy to come by, but they are around.

Simon
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#24
My preferred covering for door cards etc. (of circa pre-1932 cars) is Leathercloth from F J Ratchford in Stockport. It comes in various grain styles and looks pretty close to the stuff shown in my photo of the Chummy door above - good selection of colours, correct weight/thickness etc.

J Hewitt in Linvinstone do very a similar product but the colour choice is slightly limited.
Whatever you do, don't take my word for it!

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#25
(09-10-2018, 07:20 PM)Ruairidh Dunford Wrote: My preferred covering for door cards etc. (of circa pre-1932 cars) is Leathercloth from F J Ratchford in Stockport.  It comes in various grain styles and looks pretty close to the stuff shown in my photo of the Chummy door above - good selection of colours, correct weight/thickness etc.

J Hewitt in Linvinstone do very a similar product but the colour choice is slightly limited.

I am a little confused! I am NOT an upholsterer.
As I understand it.... staples could be used on the reverse side to hold the upholstery to the backing? This will give a smooth finish externally and may be better than adhesive (or use both?)
How then is the panel held (unobtrusively) to the door frame? Is this where the Gimp pins come in? to tack (mixing the verbs!) the panel to the wooden door frame.
There is not much of a lip on the aluminium trim door top rail for the trim panel to locate so it will have to be pinned. all round the periphery of the trim panel. If so, how often? That Chummy door looks to have a lot!
I have a supplementary question. How is the door check strap retained on the A post? Mine has a loop sewn in with a metal rod that doesn't seem to match the fitting on the A post. I better take some photos & start a new thread!
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#26
As I understand it.... staples could be used on the reverse side to hold the upholstery to the backing? This will give a smooth finish externally and may be better than adhesive (or use both?)

## If you are using ply less than 3mm you may have no choice but glue, otherwise if you can avoid punching staples through to the face side , use both.

How then is the panel held (unobtrusively) to the door frame? Is this where the Gimp pins come in? to tack (mixing the verbs!) the panel to the wooden door frame.

## Yes evenly spaced and as few as possible, say 1 on each corner and 2 extra in between. I feel that the door trim on Ruairidh's photo has been removed and reinstalled with an extra set. Others may correct. If you examine the trim below the door, it is held by the metal wiring cover but the top edge despite the obvious abuse , has far fewer pins.

There is not much of a lip on the aluminium trim door top rail for the trim panel to locate so it will have to be pinned. all round the periphery of the trim panel. If so, how often? That Chummy door looks to have a lot!

## Further to my mission to use as few fastenings as possible, I would NOT fold over and glue the top edge to the ply back, but leave it sticking up till after the pins are secured on the other 3 sides THEN fold it over and glue it to the TOP of the door. Finally screw down the aluminium capping. e.g. no pins along the top edge and no gaps looking down.
While I'm at it I'd suggest NOT gluing the rexine/leather etc. to the Face side of the ply for a smoother finish

I have a supplementary question. How is the door check strap retained on the A post? Mine has a loop sewn in with a metal rod that doesn't seem to match the fitting on the A post. I better take some photos & start a new thread!

I await your photos,   cheers  Russell
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#27
(10-10-2018, 02:55 PM)squeak Wrote: As I understand it.... staples could be used on the reverse side to hold the upholstery to the backing? This will give a smooth finish externally and may be better than adhesive (or use both?)

## If you are using ply less than 3mm you may have no choice but glue, otherwise if you can avoid punching staples through to the face side , use both.

How then is the panel held (unobtrusively) to the door frame? Is this where the Gimp pins come in? to tack (mixing the verbs!) the panel to the wooden door frame.

## Yes evenly spaced and as few as possible, say 1 on each corner and 2 extra in between. I feel that the door trim on Ruairidh's photo has been removed and reinstalled with an extra set. Others may correct. If you examine the trim below the door, it is held by the metal wiring cover but the top edge despite the obvious abuse , has far fewer pins.

There is not much of a lip on the aluminium trim door top rail for the trim panel to locate so it will have to be pinned. all round the periphery of the trim panel. If so, how often? That Chummy door looks to have a lot!

## Further to my mission to use as few fastenings as possible, I would NOT fold over and glue the top edge to the ply back, but leave it sticking up till after the pins are secured on the other 3 sides THEN fold it over and glue it to the TOP of the door. Finally screw down the aluminium capping. e.g. no pins along the top edge and no gaps looking down.
While I'm at it I'd suggest NOT gluing the rexine/leather etc. to the Face side of the ply for a smoother finish

I have a supplementary question. How is the door check strap retained on the A post? Mine has a loop sewn in with a metal rod that doesn't seem to match the fitting on the A post. I better take some photos & start a new thread!

I await your photos,   cheers  Russell
Thank you Russell, very helpful.
May take a day or so, about to paint the tub & wings on the AG!
  AND the 1927 Chummy I bought from Seattle is about to dock, so a bit of frantic shuffling in the garage... (daughter's garage actually!)
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#28
Today whilst installing an interior light in my early Top Hat I had the chance to look at the interior coverings. They are a mixed lot of black rexine original back seat to various different grains as repairs and recovers were done over time. 
I noticed the door panel had as many pins as the picture posted by Ruairidh but it in later years had been refitted with a new ply backing. Then I noticed the panel beneath which appeared not to have ever been removed and lo and behold old  Gymp pins every 3.5 to 4 inches. It seems that I will have to reassess my dislike of too many pins. I remain committed to fewer is better if using screws.
Sorry if I led anyone astray, humble pie tonight    Russell
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#29
(09-10-2018, 02:15 PM)squeak Wrote: Gymp pins.... are decorative nails, with a small (say 2mm) head, often raised, various lengths. Used for attaching GYMP( woven braid such as Jon has pictured on another thread regarding Top Hat headlining).  Also used wherever upholstery fastenings will be viewed. I use hot melt glue these days for gymp braid.
Escutcheon pins.... are similar to the previous but have larger heads (say 3mm). They are used to anchor keyhole escutcheons, small nameplates AND the metal trim pieces at the end of "hidem binding". 
Upholstery pins....  are decorative broad headed (say 6mm or larger) plated or painted nails, usually short. These will be used to visibly fasten flat tape where an edge is to be concealed. Sometimes used side by side in rows with no tape.
Cut Tacks.... sharp, tapered, no rust protection, various head sizes and lengths, uses in all other areas where unseen e.g Hidem binding or under seat squabs, under braid, in fact anywhere you would now use staples. 
Staples.... need no explanation,quick and easy. Mechanical fastenings are better than glue in many cases. A TIP here, where a trim is thin say 3mm,  short cut tacks do not hold. Using a longer staple say 4mm but with the staplegun held over at 45degrees before firing, you get a stronger result.   Go to it guys  Russell

The upholsterers version of rivet counting? Fascinating stuff I wouldn't learn anywhere else. Very cool!

One tip if you're using hot melt glue to attach things is isopropyl alcohol is great are making it let go. Spray a bit of that on it and the glue loses it stick.

Simon
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#30
(09-10-2018, 07:20 PM)Ruairidh Dunford Wrote: My preferred covering for door cards etc. (of circa pre-1932 cars) is Leathercloth from F J Ratchford in Stockport.  It comes in various grain styles and looks pretty close to the stuff shown in my photo of the Chummy door above - good selection of colours, correct weight/thickness etc.

J Hewitt in Linvinstone do very a similar product but the colour choice is slightly limited.

Ruairdh
Received some of the leather cloth from Ratchford today, and must say it is excellent.
The thickness and texture seems sympathetic to the original.
I will post a few photos when I've had a go.
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